The views expressed in this article are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the views of Gunset Training Group or its affiliates.
Click HERE to view the original post on the GunSnobbery Blog
Author’s note: this is part 9 in a series of educational posts I am going to write about State of Ohio and federal weapon and firearm laws. Part 1 can be found here. There is a list of the previous articles at the bottom (or side, depending on your device) of the page. This post does not offer legal advice. I am not a lawyer. I am a Certified Firearm Specialist through the International Firearm Specialist Academy and the State of Ohio certifies me to teach Ohio’s weapon laws in the Basic Police Academy. I’ve spent quite a bit of time studying federal law and Ohio’s laws in 30 years on the job. More than anything, this series of posts is an attempt to educate people on portions of the law and to show them where they can find the laws so that they can educate themselves further. Please consult with an attorney who specializes in firearms and weapons law if you have questions that require a legal opinion. If you are a law enforcement officer, check with your jurisdiction’s legal counsel for guidance. And remember, not all attorneys are created equal. And keep in mind that laws, interpretations of laws and definitions change. So what was current at the time I published this article may have changed over time.
Before we get into the private property specific information, I need to add one more thing about the list of prohibited locations I discussed in the last article. Ohio Revised Code 2923.1212 requires those prohibited locations to post signs with specific language (see picture above) in one or more “conspicuous locations” so that people know they cannot carry there. However, just because a sign is not conspicuously posted does not mean that you can carry into the building. As a law abiding citizen, you are required to know the statutorily prohibited locations and abide by them. Now, onto private property.
When it comes to carrying firearms, whether they are carried openly or concealed, private property is a much different story than government buildings or statutorily prohibited zones. I am a firm believer in private property rights. Although I think banning firearms from your business is stupid, I respect the fact that it is your property and it is your right to make that decision. Just like it is my right to shop elsewhere. And I do whenever I can.
If you read this article, you may have been surprised to see that a couple of private institutions were not on the list of statutorily prohibited locations – banks and hospitals. That’s right, neither banks nor hospitals are statutorily prohibited carry zones under Ohio law. But, under Ohio Revised Code 2923.126(C)(1), private entities like banks and hospitals (or any other private business or institution) can post signs on their entrances that prohibit the carrying of firearms in some way. Unlike Texas, there is no statutorily required language that Ohio businesses need to use on their signs. They can simply say “No Guns Allowed”. Or it could be a readily identifiable “gun buster” sign like the one pictured above. As long as the sign clearly indicates the business’s prohibition on weapons beyond that point, the business can use whatever sign they desire.
I play this game when I go out that’s called “find the no guns sign”. Most of the time, the “no guns” sign is prominently displayed on the front door or the glass window next to the front door. I have; however, seen “no guns” signs in some truly ridiculous places. For example, one area theater did not have their “no guns” sign on the main doors to the theater. Instead, the “no guns” sign was beyond the ticket kiosk, beyond the concession area and mounted on the podium where you hand over your ticket after going past concessions. And it was at the bottom of the podium about ankle height under a bunch of other information. Now why is that important? Well, carrying into a business that has a “no guns allowed” sign prominently displayed is much harder to justify later on than would be with the theater’s sign set up.
When it comes to private businesses banning firearms there are two things the business owner needs to understand. First, a private employer cannot create a policy that, in effect, prohibits employees from exercising their 2nd Amendment rights outside of work. After Ohio passed the CCW law, some companies created policies that banned employees from carrying at work, in work owned vehicles and anywhere on work owned property. Including the parking lots. So, depending on where you worked, you were not able to carry to and from work without risking your job because there was no practical work around. As of 2017, that is no longer the case. Employees can leave their weapon in their personal vehicle (if you drive a work owned car you are just SOL) as long as they keep it locked up and the vehicle is in a place where it is otherwise allowed to be (see 2923.1210(A) in pic above). What happens if the employer says, “screw it, we’re banning them from the parking lots anyway”? Well, that’s where 2923.1210(B) comes in. The employer can be sued and be found liable. Lawsuits get expensive.
And second (and maybe most important), under 2923.126(C)(2)(a)-(d) businesses, non-profits, government subdivisions, and institutions of higher education are all immune from liability for most situations arising from people carrying a concealed handgun on/in their property. So if you own a business and are worried about liability, talk to your legal counsel about whether you actually have any liability if you take the “No Guns Allowed” signs down.
The law is also very clear about one thing – landlords cannot prevent their tenants from carrying concealed. Nor can the landlords ban their tenants guests from doing so, as long as the tenant is present.
Although ignoring “No Guns Allowed” signs at most private locations could just lead to a fourth degree misdemeanor trespassing charge, there are a couple of instances where it can be a more serious crime. The first instance would be if the pistol was carried into a posted liquor establishment. I’ll spend more time talking about liquor establishments in a future article, but know that carrying into one that has “No Guns Allowed” sign is a felony. The next would be a day care center that’s posted.
Although the child care centers in this statute are not defined, they are defined in ORC 5104.01 if you’re interested in learning more about them. Child care centers used to be statutorily prohibited like government buildings and schools, but that part of the law was changed several years ago. Now, they need to be posted. If you do carry into one, the minimum penalty is a first degree misdemeanor (unloaded gun). Since most of us carry loaded guns, the violation would be a felony.
To wrap things up, let’s discuss “No Guns Allowed” signs in parking lots or parking facilities. I have seen these from time to time. The important thing to know is this: you can get in “trouble” if you ignore these signs, just not the criminal kind. Huh? Under 2923.126(C)(3)(a), ignoring these signs is a civil, as opposed to criminal trespass. Which means the police cannot charge you with trespassing, and the property owner would have to sue you civilly for trespassing in his property. I have never seen or even heard of that happening in real life, so I have no idea how that works.
I’ll finish up with an admonition to my fellow gun owners. Be nice. Remember that you are an ambassador for all law abiding gun owners. If you come across a business that does not allow firearms and you feel the need to address that with the business, don’t be a jerk. Remember the guy who lost his mind on the teenage girl working the drive thru window of Chik-Fil-A years ago? A poor kid who had nothing to do with the CFA policy that idiot disagreed with bore the brunt of his ridiculous behavior. Don’t be that guy. If you come across like the CFA guy, what are the odds that you will ever convince that business to change their policy? Zero. Please remember, you represent all of us.
Next week I’ll dive into schools, liquor establishments and courthouse……..